Wanted to give everyone an update of what happened at tonight's meeting.
1. A building permit was added to the agenda before the meeting. Under the Iowa Open Meetings Law, a tentative agenda must be posted 24 hours prior to the commencement of the city council meeting. However, this building permit was not included in the tentative agenda that was posted at least 24 hours before the city council meeting.
2. The first reading of the amendment to Ordinance 232 passed 3-0 (Benson and Vegors abstained). This amendment would give the park board power to hire the employees of the golf course (The City Council does have objection power over hiring decisions).
3. There was a motion to accept Ms. Kristi Ott's petition that she presented to the council a few weeks ago, which was intially rejected. The vote was 2-2 (Vegors, Diehl voted yes, Benson abstained due to a potential conflict of interest).
I will have another posting sometime tomorrow.
I heard that they were having people sign in before the meeting. Is that true? I was not there so I don't know. If so, I do believe that violates the open meeting laws.
ReplyDeleteI heard this also. Is it true?
ReplyDeleteYes, there was a sign-in sheet at last night's meeting.
ReplyDeleteThere was a sign in sheet at the community center meeting also. Why would this be considered a violation of the open meetings law?
ReplyDeleteFrom my understanding a city council meeting is an open meeting. It could be considered intimidation to have people sign in at open meetings. If the community center meeting you are referring to is a council meeting then it was in violation of the open meeting laws.
ReplyDeleteI also heard that when someone wanted a copy of public record they were asked to fill out a paper to request this. I think this is also
ReplyDeletea violation.
I think the Mayor should take a course on being a Mayor possibly Mayor 101.
ReplyDeletePeople regularly misinterpret or misquote Iowa Code and Iowa law on here.
ReplyDeleteI wonder why we don't see any posts from them, "Hey, great news! I signed up for Pre-law 101"
Nobody has quoted any law here today. However by the very nature of open meeting as in the Iowa code, there is no provision for sign up sheets. The fact is there is no reason to ask anyone to sign their name to attend a public hearing. I think it was an intimidation factor. Personal opinion mind you. I didn't make it last night so I don't know if it was voluntary or if it was suggested that a person sign. If anyone walked away because they might have felt intimidated by a sign up sheet then that would violate the open meeting laws. All this aside, why would they even have a sheet to sign to go to the meeting? Someone must have felt they has a reason and if so, what was it? I agree, the Mayor needs to take Mayoral Conduct 101.
ReplyDeleteTo 5:07 PM:
ReplyDeleteWhat has been misinterpreted or misquoted?
I don't know what was misinterpreted or misquoted. I just wanted to throw in that many years ago I have taken many business law and pre law college classes. They were very interesting and informative and I did learn many interesting things from them. There is nothing wrong with furthering your education if you are able to. Also reading the local state laws regarding meetings helps if you are involved with them.
ReplyDeleteI think the only way that a sign up sheet would be considered intimidating would be if you were FORCED to sign it. Unless you're a lawyer it's tough to know exactly what the code in question means.
ReplyDeleteTo post 2:43
Go to the courthouse/statehouse and ask for a copy of a public record and you'll be asked to sign for it.
I think some of you are searching for stuff to complain about.
ReplyDeleteTO: 7:29 PM I think some of these things need to be looked at and discussed. I don't think people are searching for things to complain about. There has been so many grey areas in all of this I think it is making people question other areas.
ReplyDeleteWhatever! Can anyone say; NITPIK
ReplyDeleteTo those who think some of us just want something to complain about: Why did the sign up sheet majically appear at the last meeting? I have been to many council meetings and have never seen one before. Many of you are right. There are many grey areas in all of this, and neither I nor anyone else on here are lawyers, but the fact remains that if you are asked to sign up to attend an open and public meeting, that to some might be considered intimidation. I would still like someone to answer a question I had earlier. Why the sign up sheet at all? They certainly didn't draw for door prizes. Just someone, please answer the reasoning behind it.
ReplyDeleteThe better question is, what was the building permit request for? Would have delay of the building permit somehow delayed building or improving something needed for operating the golf course? Would have delay cost money or detered from making money? Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.
ReplyDeleteTodays post says a 'tentative' agenda has to be put out 24 hours in advance. The word tentative is used twice. Does 'tentative' mean there may be additions or subtractions to the agenda? I'm not sure what else 'tentative' would mean other than that. Why wouldn't someone find it reasonable to assume it would refer to there may be changes?
I do not know what the official rationale behind the sign up sheet was. Something I just thought of was, when people were kicked out of the state house last week, the media knew exactly how many were asked to leave. If I remember correctly, Des Moines TV will sometimes report a number of how many people show up at the state house, city council, schoolboard, etc. How do they have that exact number? Do they have a sign in sheet? I don't know the answer.
ReplyDeleteAs for intimidation, I absolutely know that is not the case. Some of this is just a little rediculous. The people on the council are not strangers to any of us. Come on...do you honestly believe they would try to scare or threaten people from showing up? If you do believe that, you really don't know these people well.
As far as knowing how many people were at the a Statehouse last week I believe the media counted them as I searched the article and it said approximately 500 people. As for intimidation I don't know. What other rationale could there be? Samadams I like your idea about door prizes. Wish I would win one someday. In order to run a good business or to make sure things remain completely on the up and up a little NITPIKING could help.
ReplyDeleteI guess if I or others ask questions we should be silenced or attacked with name calling.
Should someone be silenced or attacked with name calling? I checked all these posts, nobody called anyone names. It's still hurtful though isn't it? It probably felt like you were being attacked or called names.
ReplyDeleteFlip it around; you just implied you couldn't think of any other rationale than intimidating others to ask for a sign in sheet. How do you think that feels to them? If they had a valid reason for putting out the sign up sheet that you aren't aware of, do they deserve to be attacked or name called?
Nobody on the city council, parks board or Mayor has to answer to this blog. Sorry, it's the truth. We're a dozen of opinionated people just spouting off, hurting people along the way.
Lots of conversation in here about open meeting laws. Participate in the open meetings. Go there, go to the podium and speak. Sending a signed letter in to the letter of the editor has been a long time method of citizens participating or voicing their opinon to local government. Ask to speak privately to council members or Mayor.
And, you may or may not get what you want.
This blog is not a good idea. It's devisive, hurtful and tearing apart this community. Am I as guilty as everyone else for feeding the fire, yep. Right or wrong, I've tried to point out the other side of things. Maybe it's just time for everyone to stop this.
We have a community full of opionionated people. This blog has given them the opportunity to question and ask for answers without retaliation. I feel it is a good thing. There are questions that need to be answered. I get the D.R. and there have been quite a few letters to the editor, pro and con.
ReplyDeleteThis is a blog. Check out other blogs and you will find they are just like this. I don't think anyone is seriously personally setting out to hurt individuals. What about this particular posting has everyone so upset? I
think many of the others have been more hot topics. I will continue to blog here. I'm
sorry that this has upset you so much.
I have to agree with Taxpayer.
ReplyDeletePeople on this blog tend to jump to conclusions, get defensive, and say things out of anger. And I'M GUILTY of everyone of them. I think we ALL need to look at everyones comments objectively, not critically.
I think debate is good, as long as it can done without getting personal, or taking everything personal. And every issue doesn't need to have a conspiricy theory thrown in.
If you have a concern, or a question on why something was done. Ask! 99% of the time you'll get an honest answer, and it probably wont' be what you thought it would be. Why get other people wound up with speculation. Get the answer then if you still have concerns, bring them up.
We all need to be a little more tollerant of each other. This isn't you against me, or us against them. It's about trying to keep our town thriving, agreeing or disagreing, but most of all, keeping it together as a community.
"Can't we all just get along"
Just my feelings about a few things.
Al
I think this discussion started because of the sign up sheet. Why was there a sign up sheet at this meeting and at one other that I know of? I think that is what some want answered. I am not writing this in anger. I am writing it in my word processor program so I can copy and paste it to the blog so I can correct my spelling.
ReplyDeleteI agree that people should try to get along. This all started because of some scathing articles that were written. Then the loss of money was brought to light and a new board has been appointed to attempt to correct this problem. I hope that they can succeed so that Dayton can have the best of both worlds. If this cannot be accomplished then hard decisions will need to be made.
From reading the posts today I see that there are other questions regarding other areas in the City and how meetings are being conducted. Is it wrong to question? No, there is never a stupid question. When questions are asked and answered that is where our knowledge comes from.
Can’t We All Just Get Along? I think we can. It is human nature to debate and with a good debate anger does enter into it at times when there are strong convictions. I think we as a community will continue to function. There maybe changes, but with any change it does become old at some point and people do get used to it.
Look at our Country at a whole at this time. There is so much controversy. This blog helps us keep these topics apolitical and not on a personal level so that if you see me or I see you out and about we need to feel anger towards each other.
Correction;
ReplyDeleteThis blog helps us keep these topics apolitical and not on a personal lever so that if you and I see each other out and about we need not feel anger towards each other.
You know something just came to mind. Since there has been so many nasty things said about the council, parks & rec board, maybe the reason for the sign in sheets is they are afraid of retaliation against the members. For example vandilism, personal assaults. If people at the meetings sign in, this gives them a list of suspects, in the event of something happening. I mean you've got to admit it's been pretty heated at times. Just a thought
ReplyDeleteJust a few of my thoughts:
ReplyDeleteFirst, I don't think anything on this blog has gotten out of hand. Certainly in no way enough to be tearing apart a town. Besides a few all cap words and a few rants here and there it has been very civil.
Second, I don't see a need for a sign in sheet. I don't believe there is a reason for one. A sign up sheet should not be used as a list of suspects in my opinion.
The reason for the sign in sheet was simple: the assistant city clerk is NEW and from OUT OF TOWN and wanted a list of names to reference when she typed up the minutes. Nothing sinister. Nothing malicious. Just trying to get the best information in the minutes.
ReplyDeleteSecondly, I think if we are going to dwell on the inappropriateness of council meetings, perhaps we should look at some of the things the audience gets away with. Name-calling, yelling, threatening, interrupting, swearing, etc. has been very common place and is much more intimidating and detrimental, in my opinion, than a sign in sheet designed to help a new employee do the best job possible.
I was at a meeting where one of the council person's used some very inappropriate language prior to the meeting and during the meeting. I did not hear any name calling at several of the meetings I have attended. I certainly have not called anyone names and do not believe in doing this. I have read and heard quite a bit of name calling. I agree this needs to stop from both sides. I believe that if you address the council in the open session at the end you are to say your name. This could have eliminated the need for the sign up sheet. If the sign up sheet was used at the coucil meeting at the community center, was the new employee taking notes then?
ReplyDelete